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IT IS Star Trek it's just not the Tv philosophical greatness. Even Wrath of Khan is following meny of the things talked about here. The movies aren't the tv shows. Never have been. Probably never will be. But that's ok.
I like that you gave a good reason/explanation as to why "This Isn't Star Trek." I think we all know why it's like that.. Movie Studio's just using something to make money... Playing it safe by pandering to the mass audience/action over thinking. But what ticks me off, you could have cool action and traditional Star Trek in there... It would of been cool to see Kirk, realistically having to deal with the quilt of leadership, the realization that people are dying under his command (a reality that every military commander must deal with to do the job, must be harsh)... and that is a very adult thing.. while the villain could of lost all humanity, guilt... been a good contrast.. But we never came to close to something thought out... And yeah.. I hear you.. the Kong Fu stuff... eh...
"Cultural vandalism"... Jesus, overdramatic much? This was the most Star Trek of the Kelvin movies. Have you seen a Star Trek movie ever? They're NEVER as deep as the TV show. You, sir, are being ridiculous. I don't think the films are perfect, either as films or as Star Trek material. But you're being totally too hard on this.
I think its the limitations of 90's TV that caused Star Trek to have more cerebral and clever storytelling. Nowadays, they can do anything with a computer so why do they need to invent a good story or explore an issue?
I don't know, dude, it's like you weren't paying attention at all to the movie to say that it was totally devoid of philosophy. The point of the movie, or of the villain rather, is that competition makes people stronger. He believed that the Federation, by bringing peace & cooperation to different species, was making humanity weaker. His intentions where to introduce strife & conflict because he believed that such actions made people stronger.
A lot of people believe that's exactly what's happening in society today. That we got it too easy. We don't struggle enough, so, instead of getting stronger, we atrophy and die.
I guess you prefer people just standing around and talking, but that just doesn't make for a good Star Trek movie. No one wants another Star Trek: TMP.
It was still better than the other two even if only for the death of the Apple Enterprise, in fact I'd go so far as to say there were moments when I thought "this is almost Star Trek". Still a bag of crap though.
I just started listening to your vlogs recently, so pardon my not knowing everything all at once. I'm a Star Trekker from way back--from the 1960s. I've seen all the series and watched all the movies. And I do agree with you, Dave, these new ones stink to heaven. You give really cogent and well thought out reasons for your objections, and I enjoy your explanations very much.
I do have one suggestion--I hope I'm not sounding too Pollyanna-ish here, so please take this seriously but not derogatorily. Could you please cut down on the F-bombs? I can understand your frustration, and believe me, I do empathize with you about these movies. But please, your intellect is so much better than using the F-word over and over to show your fury. Use more of that huge vocabulary you give evidence of already. You really ought to teach a course in film criticism, you know? But you couldn't really do that effectively if you use so many F***s in a row.
Again, Dave, please take this one suggestion in the spirit in which I offer it. You are really brilliant in your analysis of films. I am an English teacher, and I know good criticism when I hear it. So I look forward to catching up with all your videos & hearing more from you soon.
Totally agree with the Kirk confliction. Check Generations, shatnered fucking died being a captian after kicking Bueller's homey into the bitch seat. All of which was summed up into his own words: "The moment they take you out of the Captain seat you can't make a difference." Reboot Kirk just bitched alot.
You would have thought is you got the job of writing the screenplay for a film you would actually watch the original source material to see how it had been done previously and enlarge on the ethos and canon of that, the HISHE video for this film is great as well especially for the ending!
Yeah beyond was not that good I will say it was better than into darkness. As a whole the reboot movies have not been good they just don't seem to understand what star trek is about. Now yeah most of the trek films have been more action packed than the various series but they still retain the heart of what star trek is. I will give the new movie a thumbs up on casting Carl Urban and Anton Yelchin they actually captured the characters. Simon Pegg though while I like him as an actor is a terrible Scotty. The rest of the cast I'm indifferent towards. I think I'll stick to ToS, TNG, DS9, Voyager and STO for my trek fix ebterprise can join the rest of the crap fest. Though the cast was good they just never hit the mark with the stories.
Star Trek: Beyond is not my favorite Star Trek movie, but you seem to have missed a lot of what happened. Example: Kirk realized he already had the best federation crew, so no need to become a vice admiral at Yorktown. Also, funny that you disliked this movie so much, considering that Simon Peg, a douche bag who likes to criticize Star Wars producers/writers for not understanding its origin story, wrote this movie to be more true to the source material and for the fans.
If films like this pulled viewers who like their popcorn films and avoiding deep thoughts into a show like TOS or DS9 then I wouldn't mind. I'd have entertaining enough films that make my popcorn taste slightly better and excellent shows for deep contemplation. But that never happened. The show that we all expected never happened. Discovery happened, it happened like a bathroom trip after Taco Bell, big, fast, painful, and dumb, Discovery happened. At the very least, a very few people have put up with the dated nature of the shows to see the excellence behind the sometimes muddy or crude exterior, and that is almost enough for me to forgive these films for their flaws.
The new Star Trek films were designed for broad audience. For people can easily get into the film, but then again what drew people to Trek and even Star Wars was its uniqueness. If a lot of people are disliking your video, you made point they refuse to accept.
it came out well before brexit. the villain felt that the federation needed a military, mainly the humans. the federation dismissed their military (makos), though they did offer to give some high ranking ones a captain seat. so his attack was just to show how weak they are without a military. starfleet claims to not be a military, but again it is starfleet that stands in for the federation's military. so the most coherent message is that the idea that starfleet is not a military is stupid.
hope that helps, not that it would make the movie into anything good.
Yes, in "the Montion Picture", Kirk craved for the capitaincy, and took it almost by force from Decker, but he wasn't sure of being still qualified for the job. That's why he was so aggressive towards Decker. His questioning in "Beyond" seemed normal to me and closer to the original Kirk.
who cares .its just a film or tv. Get a life. write your own star trek story. I stopped watching movies at the age of 30, there just for kids and simple folk, read Jung or something challenging , its up to you to fulfill yourself, things will only get worse as you get older and the creators get younger.
Villains motivation: Krall believes the Federation is weak, this is due to him serving in the Xindi and Romulan wars that took place during and after Enterprise, after living through two wars that saw MILLIONS dead he viewed Starfleets new "Pacifistic explorer" mindset as stupid, Starfleet then assign him to a deep space exploration ship and he takes his grievances with him.
Skip forward some time and the Franklin goes missing, after enough time and no signs of Starfleet even noticing they were gone, the clearly disturbed captain starts going insane.
This isn't explained in a book or comic or in an interview by an actor...it's explained in the movie, while there are glaring issues with these new movies which I certainly agree with, terrible writing doesn't seem to be one of them, it's just the fact that these movies are heavy on the action with very little room for taking a breath.
I'm going to be honest if it wasn't for the new films I wouldn't have gone back to see the OG series and I'm loving everything, I remember when I was a kid I enjoyed the OG series but when I got older I kinda forgot about Star Trek it was out there as a pop culture reference for me.
But I saw the 2009 with Kirk and the OG characters and I was in, then after watching it and loving the movie went back and watch the whole series.
And right now I'm watching it again and watching NG, and going to go through all the series but the spark ignited with the new movies.
And now I'm a fan and love the filosóficas discutimos that the series put forward one of my favorite episodes is a taste of Armageddon that episode is so intense.
But what I'm trying to get at is that the new movies helped me like more the series and its content so I hope the new movies do the same for some new fans.
Dave - I do appreciate your general disgust:-D And after watching your review You Tube (I guess?) is advertising just above the comment section (just above where I am typing this comment out no less) Star Trek Beyond to "WATCH FROM $12.99". I had to share the Irony (w/ a capital I).
Remember Mr. Cullen and spoiler alert to all who have not seen it. It is an alternative universe. As in the first movie, the older Spork came to the past and threw out the present that the original fans of this beloved series know. But it doesn't excuse the loopholes of the story plot. Only watched the first one of the new ones anyway. And a fan of the Next Generation more. So probably watch the rest of the movies though out of curiosity.
Fucking movies! All of them are GARBAGE. I think there is no hope for good content in films nowadays. Everything looks and smells like shit to me. Star Wars, Star Trek... make me feel sick! What is going on? Why is this fucking world so garbage? I am getting crazy of living. Damn!
While I appreciate your overall sentiment, I will say that out of the 3 movies in the JJverse, this one felt the most like actual Star Trek. I realize in making that statement that my expectations were knocked through the floor by the first two movies, but there were a few nice moments between Kirk and McCoy and Spock and McCoy (McCoy in fact was given much more to do in the movie and in general Karl Urban's portrayal is much closer to the original than anyone else).
Having said that, I totally agree that the writers simply do not understand what makes Star Trek great. No, Star Trek should not be all PC like TNG tended to be, but it still is about a hopeful future.
And what really just completely dumbfounds me is that there was no attempt whatsoever (other than the brief glimpse of the original crew) to tie this film to the 50th anniversary of Star Trek. I didn't need a Shatner cameo (though that would have been cool), but at least something in the promotion for the film.
I liked this movie far more than the previous two, but yeah, as far as Star Trek films are supposed to be interesting thought pieces full of philosophy about morality, yeah it was a hot mess. By the time the rock song thing happened I was just having dumb fun, and I missed that entire message, but I wasn't paying a ton of attention by that point.
I would love to watch a modern Star Trek film where the ship isn't absolutely devastated or completely destroyed. (Also, for some reason I thought it was hilarious that the animation of you from other videos is actually super-accurate :) ) Keep up the good work!
If you would ask me what I want from Star Trek, I would answer: "I want it to be not dumb".
Star Trek can be anything, except dumb. The reboot movies are dumb. They are dumb by design. They are almost proud of how dumb they are.
Perfect review. I agree 100%. Especially the fucking shaky cam shit. God I'm so fucking sick of that style that is nothing but a way to create the fastest headache! I wish they would shoot action like John Wick or Atomic Blonde.
Ok, you had me the whole way...up until 'Krall's motivation. His motive for destroying the Federation was partly 'unity' (with hugs...wat?) but also because he felt that United Earth, minus Vulcans, Tellerites and Andorians, was stronger and when he was given a command and the MACOs were disbanded, he felt Earth was becoming soft and not upholding the ideals that he joined and fought with the MACOs for. It wasn't simply because no one gave him a hug for 200 years. (Tho I'd admit if someone had the balls to make a movie where that was the motivation it wouldn't be good but it would be...unique) You're kinda trying to fit the narrative to fit your argument and it doesn't quite...err, fit. Everything else does. I still liked the movie for what it was and it >is< entertaining. It may not be strickly Star Trek but that doesn't get people in the theatre seats anymore and realistically, that's what Paramount is only looking at. They're a company, they make money, people in seats means more money so...there you go.
Jar Jar Abrams handed this off to one of his flunkies. Into Darkness was on Netflix, so I put it on while I was doing dishes. It's now 2018, and I still don't have enough morbid curiosity to put this on. Actually, the look of the Enterprise is too repellent for me to click on it.
That's The Illuminati's work in Hollywood but I do agree with you 100% I think they deliberately want to destroy Star Trek because of its hopeful outlook on humankind I've been a fan since 66 and I totally agree with you what I think is going to be funny as when these Star Trek actors that are doing Discovery come to a Star Trek convention that is going to be funny personally I think it's Gene Roddenberry son he hated Star Trek when he was younger because it kept him away from his father so now he's just going to destroy it that's because Gene Roddenberry son wants revenge for all the times that Star Trek took his dad away from him and this is his get back plus Hollywood pushing their liberal agenda my personal opinion but that's how I see it
I hated the movie it was too much action and plus there was continuity errors. This one ship was supposed to take place near the Star Trek Enterprise continuity but they were wearing uniforms that were from JJ Kirk's era. I didn't go see this movie in theater but i rented it. The movie was so bad on so many levels. I'm done with Star Trek. Excuse me. Star Wreck.
Well said, Dave, and I couldn't have said it any better. These new Trek films are pointless, silly, lacking in any in-depth plot formulas, and really are nothing less than a live-action Saturday morning cartoon from the 1960's- all action, plenty of pointless violence, but no discernible plot.
This is why I have said countless times that there are at most, one or two Director/Producers in Hollywood that an idea of what they are doing within specific genres. Most of them don't, which accounts for roughly 98% of Hollywood studio heads and Directors.
What we are seeing from the JJ Abrams crapfest movies is akin to watching a Justice League movie with PeeWee Herman as Superman and Joan Rivers as Wonder Woman.
People like Abrams and the clueless Hollywood studio heads who greenlight these movies need to find other work doing something more meaningful to them, like working at McDonalds, where they can't screw up a Big Mac or French Fries like they want to....
I couldn't care less who wrote them- whether it's Pegg, Chris Pine or Donald Duck, as it's irrelevant. The Abram's movies are dull, lacking in good casting, and they are disjointed reinventions of something that people don't care to watch.
It's like they spent 10 minutes casting these movies, and used actors that have very little acting talent, and are meshed with Directors and Producers who have no idea of what they are doing.